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  #61  
Old 09/16/2009, 10:52 PM
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Son of a bitch. This whole time I've been saying Irishbot for Weaver and she's Scottish. Shame on me.

I just finished 21, onto 22. I just know this is going to end anticlimactically with no hope for any resolutions. FML. Also, perhaps "Donny Where's Your Trousers?" was a bad song choice for such a solemn/portentous scene in the end of episode 21...

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  #62  
Old 09/16/2009, 11:24 PM
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I'm about 3/4 through 22 and am I seeing what I think I'm seeing?

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  #63  
Old 09/16/2009, 11:53 PM
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I just finished 21, onto 22. I just know this is going to end anticlimactically with no hope for any resolutions. FML.
Oh, you have *no* idea. With an ending like that, the sky was the fucking limit for the rest of the series -- in fact, the events of E22 might well be the most interesting, promising, anticipation-fueling setup for a forthcoming season I've ever, ever seen -- but thankfully, my good friend Joss Whedon was quick to put an end to all that with his expertly-timed return to TV. The more I think about it, the more I realize a 90-minute movie is, really, kind of a waste -- this is the kind of thing that should've played out over, at minimum, several seasons of TV. Gotta take what we can get, though, I guess.

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Also, perhaps "Donny Where's Your Trousers?" was a bad song choice for such a solemn/portentous scene in the end of episode 21...
Lyrically, granted, but holy hell was that ever haunting. If your heart didn't break even a little during that piece, you have no soul.

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I'm about 3/4 through 22 and am I seeing what I think I'm seeing?
You are. Never before have my brain and my penis been so at odds with each other.

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  #64  
Old 09/17/2009, 12:40 AM
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Yeah the burial site was really well chosen. Loved all the wind and the quiet respect the gravedigger seemed to exude.

Ugh I'm just fucking angry now. I knew I'd feel this way but I really just hate how you can get so invested in a decent show and then just know that the door is closed and nothing else will come of it.

I'm a bit confused at the temporal aspects of episode 22. I know there were several points in the series that didn't make sense from a strict single-continuum time travel perspective. The way they seem to set up time travel in the series would indicate that the events of the past are inextricably linked to how SkyNet and J-Day shake out. It seemed like about 3/4 the things they did during the series were to prevent J-Day from happening, but several of the sub plots were efforts to give them a better strategic advantage assuming that J-Day would take place. That's hedging your bets but I guess it makes sense.

What doesn't make sense is how Derek Reese goes from dead in the past to alive in the future. They can do all they want between the time Weaver and John jump forwards, but that won't make Derek any less dead. I guess it makes sense that nobody knows John because the timeline 22 ends at is presumably when John makes his name as the leader of the resistance. Then again, it means that later, John's dad, who just encountered John will go backwards and knock up chickenshit Sarah "I'm afraid of the time bubble" Connor. How then does that infant John become the 16-18 year old John who is in the future? And if 16-18 year old John doesn't turn Allison into a robot and send her ass back THEN HOW THE FUCK DID HE GET THERE GODDAMNIT TIME TRAVEL DOESN'T MAKE SENSE.

Oh and the scene with Cameron and John just totally ruined my whole argument about sexual tension. It was so weird and out of place it almost didn't make sense, but I just took it as the writers having a bit of fun. I still don't understand what exactly it is under her "breast plate" that he was feeling, why it was cold and how this would be useful if she goes bad. It's hard enough as it is to get at their CPU in the skull, how the hell is he going to pin her down, take her top off and reach around inside her sternum if she's gone berzerk? Oh well, at least he got to see Glau's tits which is more than I can say for myself

I'm so confused right now...

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  #65  
Old 09/17/2009, 12:44 AM
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Ok so wikipedia cleared up part of the above. I guess feeling inside of her was a way for him to be reassured that her nuclear core wasn't leaking. Mmmm.. handful of sweet, sweet nuclear core.

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  #66  
Old 09/17/2009, 3:14 AM
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Ugh I'm just fucking angry now. I knew I'd feel this way but I really just hate how you can get so invested in a decent show and then just know that the door is closed and nothing else will come of it.
Hence, the reason for my three-seasons policy. I was broken up about the Prison Break cancellation as well, but at least I understood and appreciated it -- they'd done about all they could with the concept, and better to end the show on a high note than become the next "24". This one, though, was nothing short of a slap in the face -- particularly for someone with absolutely nothing else going on in his life. And to think, it was doing just fine on Monday night (even in the face of competition from Heroes, Dancing with the Stars, Monday Night Football, Monday Night Raw, et al) until Joss came along needing a lead-in. Thanks again, old pal.

Truly, 'tis better to have never loved at all than to have loved and lost. I'm not sure why I broke policy in the first place for a franchise I was only checking out on a friend's recommendation and, at the time, had no interest in whatsoever (I still haven't seen any of the movies), but I surely won't be breaking it again.

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What doesn't make sense is how Derek Reese goes from dead in the past to alive in the future. They can do all they want between the time Weaver and John jump forwards, but that won't make Derek any less dead.
That's a definite noodle-scratcher. My theory is, when you jump back, obviously, there's only one possible version of the past -- everything that came prior is set in stone from that point forward (at least in that particular timeline) -- but when you jump *forward*, you can potentially find yourself in any of the various temporal permutations created by Skynet and the Resistance's meddling. When you skip over time that's already been divided into a nearly infinite number of slices by such meddling (a number that'll only further increase between point A and point B), I'm not sure where you end up should (or even could) necessarily reflect where you came from.

That said, it could be argued that Skynet is needlessly complicating things for itself. It probably would've been more prudent for it to start by sending a single T-888 back after, say, young Kyle Reese instead of further and further segmenting the timeline by gunning for John and Sarah, both of whom know exactly what's coming and which portion of the head to slice open to stop it. Or perhaps Myron Stark could've taken out Kyle and Sarah's grandparents instead of powering down in a building for some reason for 80 years. But then, like Deadeye Cromartie's immaculate aim (*cough*), this is the kind of disbelief you just have to suspend when it comes to such complex subject matter. Sure, the entire series could've been resolved in the first episode, but where's the fun in that?

Another thing one might wonder is, which temporal permutation is the "correct" one? Which one ends up being the true fate of the world? Where does the war end? Can either entity ever truly defeat the other via time travel gymnastics, given that, even if, say, John is killed, one of the Johns from the future permutations in which he's still alive could then send someone back to eliminate whatever eliminates him? Or was this Skynet's master plan all along -- to kill John, or, failing that, to create such an overabundance of timelines in which it exists and possesses time travel that it becomes virtually impossible to eradicate? Food for thought.

EDIT: Epiphany! Future Derek was killed, but young Derek (the one they saw in the park) grows up to become new future Derek, which revalidates the possibility of a single timeline and makes significantly more sense, but is significantly less interesting. Mind you, an awful lot has transpired at this point without the timeline suddenly reverting to its most recent alteration. If there is, indeed, only one timeline and Skynet is constantly working to change it, shouldn't the show constantly be cutting back to five weeks/five months/five years in the past and continuing on from there? Or, if nothing else, shouldn't things at least be materializing and dematerializing out of the blue every so often? I think there's a definite case to be made for both theories, as neither seems to be bulletproof.

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Oh and the scene with Cameron and John just totally ruined my whole argument about sexual tension.
Well, that, and his split-second decision to potentially doom mankind by chasing the shebot he supposedly has no feelings for whatsoever into the future. If that's not love, I don't know what is. I don't hold it against him, though. I totally would've done the same thing. And then I would've realized she's now a big burly man and facepalmed for several days.

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It was so weird and out of place it almost didn't make sense, but I just took it as the writers having a bit of fun.
"Hey, our ratings are in the toilet, we're almost certainly going to be cancelled, and we'll never see Summer Glau in that state of undress again. Quick, someone think up a hamfisted way to get her top off!"

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Oh well, at least he got to see Glau's tits which is more than I can say for myself
Based on how criminally shy she is and the fact that even actors with no shortage of confidence like Vince Vaughn and Megan Fox are constantly yapping about the cocksocks and nipple pasties they wore in their latest flicks, I'm assuming all the naughty parts are sufficiently covered when she participates in such scenes. At least, that's how I make it through my days now without putting a gun in my mouth and blowing my brains all over the wall.

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Ok so wikipedia cleared up part of the above. I guess feeling inside of her was a way for him to be reassured that her nuclear core wasn't leaking.
Yeah, that. Better timed and better promoted, that scene alone could've provided the ratings boost they needed to make the case for a third season, but alas, no such luck/foresight. Completely ridiculous, my eyes nearly roll clear out of their sockets every time I see it, but I guess they had to get her top off somehow.

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  #67  
Old 09/17/2009, 9:56 AM
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I think I like your theory of splintering timelines into the future, but at that point it would be hard to stay motivated to fix the future. If all that work resulted in 1 of 100 futures not resulting in J-Days and then you jump to that reality, how good are you feeling about yourself knowing that there's a nuclear holocaust in the other 99. The part about young Derek being alive as a kid during this time does make sense and it is quite an impressive callbacks on the writer's part if that's what they were thinking.

Upon further contemplation and some very strange dreams, I think I see a little more value in the last scene with Cameron and John, but more as a showcase for Summer's acting ability and the flickers of emotion you started seeing in Cameron near the end. She could have easily played that scene completely deadpan and had him reach in but the fact is that it was an extremely intimate and tender scene. You could see the trust and even nervousness in her eyes and the most minute, understated facial expressions. It's chill-inducing in the same strange way as in one of the first seasons when Cameron "replayed" the emotion of the girl who killed herself to the school counselor.

Are there any other possible reasons John could have followed Weaver into the future *except* to chase Cameron's chip? Could he conceivably feel that he was needed to aid Weaver in destroying SkyNet (if she truly is on his side)? I ask because it's just SO fucking tragic that the Cameron in the future (Allison) is a human and knows nothing about him and will not be the same person. Perhaps after John Henry defeats SkyNet, he skin's Allison, puts her on a female robot endoskeleton, puts her chip back in that body and then finally gets his wish, with the additional bonus of no cockblocking from Riley or Sarah. Seams like a reasonable extrapolation, yeh?

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  #68  
Old 09/17/2009, 3:48 PM
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I think I like your theory of splintering timelines into the future, but at that point it would be hard to stay motivated to fix the future. If all that work resulted in 1 of 100 futures not resulting in J-Days and then you jump to that reality, how good are you feeling about yourself knowing that there's a nuclear holocaust in the other 99.
Ah, but is that a reality of which they'd even be cognizant?

Assuming a multi-timeline scenario, had Skynet killed young Kyle in one shot like I suggested, that gives us two timelines, and one would assume the most recently created one becomes the "correct" one. In it, Kyle dies, John is never born, Skynet is created, wins the war, and can then focus on defeating John in the other timeline from two fronts -- be it immediately, assuming they *do* know what's going on, or be it further down the line when soldiers start mysteriously appearing from that alternate reality. As is, though, the fabric of time has been divided and subdivided and subsubdivided so many times that, if either side was aware of the complexities of the situation, they'd surely lay down their arms and quit. Or, if nothing else, quit using time travel and concentrate on the countless additional wars they've already inadvertently created.

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Upon further contemplation and some very strange dreams...


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...I think I see a little more value in the last scene with Cameron and John, but more as a showcase for Summer's acting ability and the flickers of emotion you started seeing in Cameron near the end.
Potentially valid, I guess, but they could've just as easily showcased her progress in any number of other ways. If my theory didn't have at least *something* to do with it, I'll eat my own shoe.

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Are there any other possible reasons John could have followed Weaver into the future *except* to chase Cameron's chip? Could he conceivably feel that he was needed to aid Weaver in destroying SkyNet (if she truly is on his side)?
Without living through everything and building the legend of John Connor, though, he amounts to little more in the future than a punk kid, as we plainly saw before the show faded to black for the final time. Then again, it *was* a split-second decision, so I suppose it could be argued that this was another point he simply didn't spend enough time considering.

Thing is, with John Henry, Cameron's chip, and, as far as we know, friendly liquid metal now in the near-future (as opposed to the distant future we've always seen in the flashforwards), the Resistance now has the jump on Skynet, and, assuming a single timeline, the war is all but over. John could've just as easily stayed where he was, washed his hands of the matter, and taken the empty Cameron shell home for use as an even realer RealDoll. Then again, perhaps it's current John's expertise in such areas prior to anyone else possessing such expertise that establishes him as the John Connor of tomorrow; after all, we *did* see a similarly aged John in a flashforward once earlier in the show's run. Moreover, it's possible that, having known her eventual course at Zeira immediately following the meeting with Ellison and knowing full well she couldn't convince John to do the right thing with words alone, the booby scene was a calculated manipulation on Cameron's part to ensure John jumped through with her. Epiphany? Did I just crack this series wide open? See, this right here is the value of a good argument.

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Old 09/17/2009, 4:23 PM
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LOL, I love it. There's some switch logic in Cameron's programming that determines how she will persuade a human to do something. If they are younger than 14 or so, she lifts them up by the shirt and gives them the stink eye. If they are older than maybe 30 she'll choke them but if they are 14-30 she deploys boobies.

I'm not sure how to take Sarah's decision though. It was indeed a split second decision but she seemed to make it with such quiet resolve. I guess we can assume that she sees John can handle shit on his own and knows from the stunt he pulled to bust her out of prison that she would be an even greater liability in the future.

I would also like to say at this point that this series was far more entertaining for me than any of the Terminator films, especially the most recent piece of garbage they churned out.

Also I had no friggn idea that Weaver was the lead singer of Garbage. It appears that this might have been one of her first acting roles and she seems to have done a pretty good job. At times Weaver's dialog was a bit annoying, consisting mostly of things like "yes it does", "no it doesn't", etc, but she was overall quite good. In fact I'd probably rate Riley, Jesse, and John as the worst actors on the show.

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Old 09/17/2009, 6:09 PM
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LOL, I love it. There's some switch logic in Cameron's programming that determines how she will persuade a human to do something. If they are younger than 14 or so, she lifts them up by the shirt and gives them the stink eye. If they are older than maybe 30 she'll choke them but if they are 14-30 she deploys boobies.
Hey, they *are* programmed for infiltration. What better way to get humans to bend to your will than the time-honored art of booby deployment? Just ask Anna Nicole Smith or Hugh Hefner's girlfriend of the week.

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I guess we can assume that she sees John can handle shit on his own and knows from the stunt he pulled to bust her out of prison that she would be an even greater liability in the future.
Plus, hanging back allows her to continue fighting Skynet from the present, thereby providing far more aid to John in the future than standing around, watching him repair cyborgs would -- again, assuming a single timeline, which, if nothing else, is the assumption we know she's operating under. To let him go must've been immeasurably difficult and painful, but to best ensure his survival, it was the right decision to make. But then, what mother possesses the clarity to come to such a conclusion in such a short period of time?

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In fact I'd probably rate Riley, Jesse, and John as the worst actors on the show.
In my view, John and Sarah are similarly skilled. Most of the time, they fit the bill just fine, but there are subtle... ball-drops every so often (as in, "dropping the ball" -- not testicular descent) that pull you out of the experience just a little. On the whole, though, the casting of this show is one of my favorite aspects of it and was about as close to perfect as anything else has ever come. Lena's not a perfect actress, for example, but I can't picture anyone else playing Sarah. BAG was a complete and total shock -- who knew the dude from 90210 could play such a convincing badass? -- but again, I truly can't picture anyone else playing Derek. Sum? From what I've seen, she's more-or-less Cameron with a smile. This is a girl who, going in, already had 26 years of stiff and wooden experience under her belt. Similar story with the other Terminators -- Cromartie is in The 4400 with Sum and plays his role almost exactly the same, and as for Madame Garbage... that casting decision just makes complete sense to me for some reason. Riley? I can't stand her, not the best actress in the world, but again, she aptly fills the role. I'm guessing they wanted obnoxious, and boy, did they ever get it! Jesse, same sort of thing. John and Charley, really, are the only actors I could envision myself replacing, but even then, I'm not sure I would. It all worked out quite well, I think.

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Old 09/17/2009, 10:55 PM
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Something I was going to edit into the above post earlier before I saw you'd already read it:

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I would also like to say at this point that this series was far more entertaining for me than any of the Terminator films, especially the most recent piece of garbage they churned out.
I consider watching the movies from time to time. Knowing all that you now know, should I even bother? In other words, you've stated you preferred the show, and obviously, the last two films are known for being awful, but are the first two something I could accept and appreciate at all as a fan of the show? Or is that a page better left unturned?

Anyway, looks like things are winding down here. Thanks for humoring me. My friend who suggested the show to me in the first place stopped watching as soon as I started (), so it was nice to finally discuss it with someone and hammer out most of the (previously) nonsensical plot points.

When you get around to it, let me know what you think of Firefly in the Sum thread. I probably won't have much to say on the topic myself that doesn't primarily consist of the word "lulz" (which might well be a refreshing change of pace for you after all these twelve-page essays), but I'm always up for a few good zingers at Joss Whedon's expense. With a show like that, I foresee no other potential outcome.

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Old 11/08/2009, 6:44 PM
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Terminator Dude Charged With DUIs

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Originally Posted by E! Online
He'll be back, all rightófor his arraignment.

E! News has learned that Thomas Dekker, the former star of Fox's Terminator spinoff, The Sarah Connor Chronicles, has been rung up on two misdemeanor drunken-driving charges stemming from his Oct. 14 run-in with a teenage biker in the San Fernando Valley.

"He was charged with our standard DUI countsódriving under the influence and driving with a blood-alcohol level of 0.08 or above," said Los Angeles city attorney spokesman Frank Mateljan.

Talk about your bad Judgment Day.
Come with E! if you want to relive Terminator through some of the best journalism ever to hit the 'net.

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Old 11/08/2009, 7:41 PM
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I like the way that E! writes their articles but sometimes I wish they'd use more puns.

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